Square Setup

[90kacoupe]

Okay guys I lurk this forum quite a bit for inspiration for my drift car for one main reason, I feel like a good drift build starts from a nice grip setup. I know the popular thing with drift cars is staggered wheels and staggered tires sizes. (we all know the trend is hella flush)

I'm always thinking of ways to improve upon my suspension setup of my s13. I have been putting a lot of thought into the idea that a staggered wheel and tire, would make the car have some what of a "3 wheeler" effect. Obviously I'm no engineer and I have some understanding of basic physics and suspension geometry. My thoughts are that the smaller wheel and tire up front would mess with the weight transfer of the car. I felt like this is a question I should ask the "intelligent" crew of nissan owners cause we all know the answers i would get from a trendy forum.

[Def]

Our cars are nose heavy, especially if you start taking weight out of them. This calls for a square setup. A staggered setup on a nose heavy car is back asswards.


No need to get all scientific about it, thems the facts.

[Longfellow]

The last set up I ran on my S14 was 235-40-17F 255-40-17R NT05's and I actually liked it more than when I ran 255-40-17 NT05's x4. Steering was slightly lighter and more direct making it easier to steer, the back end had plent of grip but it never really "pushed" or over loaded the front tires. It actually felt extremely balanced. I doubt it was any faster, but it was easier and more fun to drive. This was also on 6k/4.5k spring set up, progress front bar, stock rear, all SPL arms, spherical upright bushings and an S15 helical differential with about 275hp/tq.

My new set up I plan on doing 235-40-17 NT05's on all 4 corners, and if I need more rear grip I'll step up to 255's again.

[Def]

You have really soft springs all around, I can't imagine the car doesn't understeer as you roll up front and lose camber on the outer front wheel...


A square setup will give less understeer than a staggered setup. You want your tire width to roughly follow weight distribution unless you've got a lot of power that changes how much heat is going in the rear tires. I'd say that number is probably around 450-500 rwhp. My front tires still wear a slight bit faster than my rear due to the 53/47 weight distribution.

[Rustys13]

This seams like a good place to put this. Is a 265/35r18 on all 4 corners going to be impossible to make fit? I am not concerned with the rear but I do drift the car and with increased steering lock will I have some very large issues? Thanks for the help.

[SoSideways]

That's going to take some work to fit up front.

You'll more than likely need to tub the fronts and not be very low, and even then, you might still run the tire into the frame rail or the firewall.

[e1_griego]

I have been running 235/255 as well for quite a while.

I need to step up to 255 but my front fenders are perfect and I'm really hesitant to make 255s fit.

[SoSideways]

I have been running 235/255 as well for quite a while.

I need to step up to 255 but my front fenders are perfect and I'm really hesitant to make 255s fit.

Hey, how that I am probably not gonna sell those GS arms, maybe I can sell you some fenders? lol

I have some 40mm wide front fenders that I will probably not use They suck for fitment, but they at least are that wide.

[Rustys13]

My car is in pretty good shape for an s13 but I have no problems cutting it up. I have plans to tub the fronts but im concerned about the rear section of the wheel well.

[e1_griego]

Hey, how that I am probably not gonna sell those GS arms, maybe I can sell you some fenders? lol

I have some 40mm wide front fenders that I will probably not use They suck for fitment, but they at least are that wide.

lol

No thanks.

I have yet to pull my fenders off which means they still fit nice

[Rustys13]

Another question is running a 265 up front too wide for a street tire? my only other choice is a 245 40 and its a 10.5 wide rim.

[Def]

265 is fine if you space it out enough and have a wide enough fender. The only problem might be the overall height of the tire and trying to go low. The bigger the tire diameter, the less steering angle you have as well. I hit my tire front and rear on the car if I do a really big correction on track (sounds like hell too, makes me nervous).

What's the tire size? 265/40-17? Going to be pretty big up front, but you can make it work if you're not trying to tuck tire. A 265 street tire is about as wide as a 255 R-comp (or less on some tires), it's then up to the tire diameter running into crap.

[Rustys13]

It is a 265/35r18 on 18x10.5-0 offset and its not super tall 25.3. I am worried about the clearance at the rear of the strut tower. I think i will have to sacrafice some caster as I am at 8.0 right now. I would like to run -2.8 camber or around there up front. The car will have pbm or driftworks knuckles come spring aswell. I will make a build thread when it comes time to fit the wheels.

[90kacoupe]

thanks for the replies everybody.

rustys13- running that size up front is useless, you will probably be better off with something smaller up front like a 235 or 245, and the reason i asked about this question is because of the new Formula D rules for the tire size cap. Your car would no longer be legal for competition on a 265 with the new rules. S-chassis will be limited to around a 235 or 255 depending on the weight of the vehicle.

The reason i ask this question is because as we enter a turn with a quick initiation we throw all the weight of the car on the leading side of the car. It feels like to me due to the aspect of being sideways the car would sit unbalanced without the square wheel and tire combo.

I guess the next question is, do our cars have any stagger in the width of the front and rear if measured from the factory hubs. If they do how much is it?

I don't have an alignment rack at my disposal as of right now, and my car is under going the winter project and I am trying to alleviate majority of my suspension issue the car had due to my prior ignorance of a good suspension setup.

[Rustys13]

I doubt I will ever be competing in formula d so that part does not concern me however I am still unsure if a 265 is just way to much tire for this size car. The sr setup I have right now is making 350whp at 16psi we are hoping to put around 20psi into it for summer so I would love to have that extra size in the rear, But I have this thing in my head that I really don't want a narrower tire up front. I wanted 255s but the place I get tires from cannot get them. They are cheap tires though so maybe running a 255 or 245 in a better grippier tire might be worth it. Thank you very much for all the input and kindness I will put a real intro up soon. Sorry for the thread jack 90kacoupe.